Preliminary Thoughts

The Hall of Fire's extended chapter by chapter discussion of Tolkien's The Lord of the Rings
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Post by Alatar »

What, in a Tolkien Forum? How absurd... ;)
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Voronwë the Faithful
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Ax, stickied threads don't stay in the order they are created; they are listed in the order of the last post made, just like regular threads (just above all regular threads). So if they were in a separate forum with no other threads, they would act just like regular threads. Given the light traffic in this forum, I'm not sure that a separate forum would be necessary even if we go with separate threads for each chapter, but it is worth considering.

Tosh, that is a very intriguing suggestion. But I think it might be difficult to actually put it into practice.
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Post by Teremia »

I think I would be tempted to paste in my old commentaries, and then comment on how my thinking was evolving this time around -- would that be dreadful?
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

No, it would be wonderful. :love:
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Post by Primula Baggins »

Good heavens, yes. :love: I don't think anybody should hesitate to do that. Many of us weren't around when those posts were first made, many more weren't tuned into those threads, and those who were probably did not memorize them or might have amplifications of their own to offer.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Post by Inanna »

I would hate for us to lose out on Romestamo's insights - so actually we should copy - paste other people's too!

I am tending more and more towards a different thread for each chapter, but no schedule. The reason is that I think people who drop out for a while are daunted by getting back into a long carrying-on discussion. Ditto for people who are dropping in for the first time. A new chapter gives folks in both sets a good chance to dip in again.
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Post by Primula Baggins »

One thing that should be pointed out at the start: We can't paste other people's posts into the discussion without their explicit permission. The poster holds the copyright on his/her words, even on a message board.

I go back and forth on the multiple threads idea, but I'm wondering if in any case it might be best to start with a single thread, just to nurture the discussion along until there are enough participants to require (and support) more threads.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

I think people give implicit permission to be quoted when they post something on a messageboard. Whether that would apply to being quoted on a different (though related) messageboard, it is hard to say. I wouldn't worry about it too much from a legal point of view. But, frankly, I'm a lot more interested in your insights, Mahima, then I am in Romestamo's. If there is something that is just absolutely on-point I don't think it would be unreasonable to quote a short statement, but I don't think a general practice should be made of copy-pasting the posts of people who are not members here.
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Post by axordil »

With attribution, I don't think quoting from anywhere is an ethical or legal issue, given that we're not making money here. It's fair use. Given that, I also would be more interested in seeing things like that to support points made by people present for the discussion, not supplanting them.
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Post by Cerin »

I think keeping the discussion in one thread might encourage people to keep pace, whereas having separate threads for each chapter might remove any sense of needing to keep up with the discussion. So I guess it depends on whether trying to keep everyone together and keeping the discussion current is one of our aims?
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Post by Inanna »

Voronwë_the_Faithful wrote:But, frankly, I'm a lot more interested in your insights, Mahima, then I am in Romestamo's.


:love:

If there is something that is just absolutely on-point I don't think it would be unreasonable to quote a short statement, but I don't think a general practice should be made of copy-pasting the posts of people who are not members here.


Of course! I didn't mean to imply that as a frequent method. Just that some discussions in the Books(Tolkien) forum have been absolutely amazing - and not from my contributions at all!
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Post by nerdanel »

I don't want to have a schedule - let it be organic, but with the more regular posters among us devoting their efforts to non-stagnation.
I won't just survive
Oh, you will see me thrive
Can't write my story
I'm beyond the archetype
I won't just conform
No matter how you shake my core
'Cause my roots, they run deep, oh

When, when the fire's at my feet again
And the vultures all start circling
They're whispering, "You're out of time,"
But still I rise
This is no mistake, no accident
When you think the final nail is in, think again
Don't be surprised, I will still rise
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Post by Primula Baggins »

Voronwë, regarding the quoting thing, short bits with attribution seem like fair use to me, but wholesale pasting of long posts does not.

I certainly don't, by posting here, give any kind of implied permission for people to quote large chunks of my posts on other boards. This is conversation, and the thought of people reading and responding to something I'd said when I am not there to hold up my side of the discussion, when I don't even know where my words have gotten to—well, it would annoy me very much.

Quoting here, of course, is entirely different; it's part of the same big conversation, and I'd be here to know it's happened.

This wouldn't come up with any post of mine, but I can't help projecting that feeling onto others.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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Post by Athrabeth »

I would prefer to see one thread meandering slowly, but surely towards the Grey Havens. :)
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Post by Sassafras »

What Ath said. :)
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Post by WampusCat »

I like the slow, meandering thread as well. But then, I've read LOTR so many times that I could easily jump back in if I quit following the discussion for a while. That might be harder for someone less familiar with the flow of the narrative.

I quit counting the number of times I read LOTR after reaching 50 (times read, not my age!), but I've never discussed it with a group. So I'm very much looking forward to this.
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

It looks like so far there is small majority in favor of a single thread. I am on the fence; I think good arguments have been made on both sides. Unless a large influx of people show up clamoring for separate threads, why don't why start with one thread and see how it goes. If it looks like it would be advantageous, we could always split off later.
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Post by superwizard »

Yay this sounds like its going to be great fun! Its funny because in the past 2 days I've written around 5 incomplete posts expressing my enthusiasm and something just just takes me by surprise and distracts me every time!

I hope to be able to contribute though I think I'll probably prefer to read all your great posts instead :)
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Post by Alatar »

:(

I was really hoping for the seperate threads.
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Post by merrybesq »

ToshoftheWuffingas wrote:Or perhaps we could tackle it by examining a theme at a time or a character at a time. That way the discussion can move up and down the narrative freely. That was a suggestion only, I am not tied to any approach.


I wouldn't mind chapter by chapter discussions, but I really like ToshoftheWuffingas idea to take a less linear approach and focus instead on themes and characters.

My real life is SO crazy-busy, like Prim was saying, that I know I'll only be able to follow along as I can manage. However the discussion is set up, though, I will definitely be checking in. :) Indeed, I will be thrilled to listen to a group so knowledgeable discuss this most beloved of all stories!
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