Gun Control Debate
- RoseMorninStar
- Posts: 12897
- Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:07 am
- Location: North Shire
Re: Gun Control Debate
My heart is forever in the Shire.
Re: Gun Control Debate
If you have guns in the house, the safest thing to do is teach the kids everything about them.
Leave them ignorant and they'll likely do something stupid with them some day.
And calling a 17 year old a child is ridiculous. I took marksmanship classes in college at 18 years old.
Leave them ignorant and they'll likely do something stupid with them some day.
And calling a 17 year old a child is ridiculous. I took marksmanship classes in college at 18 years old.
Re: Gun Control Debate
I agree, Maria. As long as access to guns is controlled at all times and safety is emphasized, I don't see a problem with a teenager participating in target shooting as a sport. (We were required to pass target shooting twice a year in high school)
That thing about running with three types of guns, on the other hand, doesn't sound sensible at all.
That thing about running with three types of guns, on the other hand, doesn't sound sensible at all.
If there was anything that depressed him more than his own cynicism, it was that quite often it still wasn't as cynical as real life.
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
Re: Gun Control Debate
I have a friend that works at a local community college's writing center. Students working on papers are able to take their papers to him at the center to get constructive feedback on their writing. He just texted me this:
My initial response was to try and rationally point out the massively glaring flaws in that argument, but then I quickly got angry at the idea of being asked to pretend this is a legitimate argument and instead proposed yelling obscenities at this student. Maybe not the most constructive response but it has better results for my sanity.
Real life claim in student essay in which they are arguing that gun control laws are ineffective and dangerous : Hitler disarmed the Jews and as a result, the Holocaust happened. What the f*** do I even say to that??????
My initial response was to try and rationally point out the massively glaring flaws in that argument, but then I quickly got angry at the idea of being asked to pretend this is a legitimate argument and instead proposed yelling obscenities at this student. Maybe not the most constructive response but it has better results for my sanity.
I wanna love somebody but I don't know how
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists
Re: Gun Control Debate
"Please provide data to substantiate these assertions," is the standard response.
When you can do nothing what can you do?
Re: Gun Control Debate
It's the kind of a statement that makes you spin in a circle because you don't even know where to start. But I agree with River.
If there was anything that depressed him more than his own cynicism, it was that quite often it still wasn't as cynical as real life.
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
- Voronwë the Faithful
- At the intersection of here and now
- Posts: 46135
- Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:41 am
- Contact:
Re: Gun Control Debate
But there is always data that can substantiate any assertion, no matter how outside the bounds of reason. It may not be accurate data, but one person's hard science is another person's fake news.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
Re: Gun Control Debate
No. Stop. This is a false equivalence. Fake news is intentional deception. People can try to pass fake news off as hard science, or bend scientific findings to suit their lies, or try to pass off poorly constructed or disproven studies and theories as valid because deceivers do those things but, unless research misconduct is involved, hard science itself isn't fake news (which isn't to say findings are never artifactual and theories are never wrong and experiments are always well-designed and perfectly controlled, only that there's a difference between being wrong and being a liar).Voronwë the Faithful wrote:It may not be accurate data, but one person's hard science is another person's fake news.
When you can do nothing what can you do?
- Voronwë the Faithful
- At the intersection of here and now
- Posts: 46135
- Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:41 am
- Contact:
Re: Gun Control Debate
That is true in the world of science (or should be; even there it isn't always) but in the world of policy-making it is almost totally not true, sadly.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
Re: Gun Control Debate
What V means is that finding data to back an assertion is not difficult, as you can find stupid data and use that too.
(Looks at forum. #%~£¥!? Shit)
(Looks at forum. #%~£¥!? Shit)
'You just said "your getting shorter": you've obviously been drinking too much ent-draught and not enough Prim's.' - Jude
Re: Gun Control Debate
True. But if you provide stupid data, you'll get feedback about it.Inanna wrote:What V means is that finding data to back an assertion is not difficult, as you can find stupid data and use that too.
(Looks at forum. #%~£¥!? Shit)
We're getting kind of a-field from my pithy suggestion to yov, though. The polite phrase I learned for "WTF is this BS?" is "Please provide data to back your assertion," or "Please cite your source for this statement," or something along those lines. Smart students soil their pants*, stammer, and slink off to fix it. Stupid ones try to argue, or cherry-pick some stupid data, and ultimately fail out of the program. And the ones who've got their heads so far up they see daylight through their mouth think they failed out because their professors were jealous of their brilliance or something.
*I didn't; instead I just got a little nauseated
When you can do nothing what can you do?
Re: Gun Control Debate
I agree with Maria and Frelga about guns and kids. If you have guns in the home, the best thing to do is to teach them to use them responsibly. My girls have handled guns since they were young teens. Competitive shooting and/or hunting may seem odd to people in other countries (or other circles), but it's pretty normal around here. (Of course, you all know I favor sensible gun control, so don't forget that.)
So my best friend (J's) brother is on the cover of Time magazine.
http://time.com/guns-in-america/?utm_ca ... e=time.com
It's kind of difficult to point him out in the mural in a forum like this; however, you can click on the search bar to find him. It's Thomas Lake. You all may recall that he was the St. Louis police sergeant who was shot in the face 2 years ago. It's a powerful story. (I haven't listened to any of the others yet.)
So my best friend (J's) brother is on the cover of Time magazine.
http://time.com/guns-in-america/?utm_ca ... e=time.com
It's kind of difficult to point him out in the mural in a forum like this; however, you can click on the search bar to find him. It's Thomas Lake. You all may recall that he was the St. Louis police sergeant who was shot in the face 2 years ago. It's a powerful story. (I haven't listened to any of the others yet.)
- RoseMorninStar
- Posts: 12897
- Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:07 am
- Location: North Shire
Re: Gun Control Debate
Yov, tell your friend there are a lot of fact checking articles for that phrase on the internet. There is something on politifact (Ben Carson has made similar statements) and there is this article from the New York Times, and others.Real life claim in student essay in which they are arguing that gun control laws are ineffective and dangerous : Hitler disarmed the Jews and as a result, the Holocaust happened. What the f*** do I even say to that??????
There is a time & place for weapons; guns, swords, knives, I suppose bombs, grenades (ugh...) but the sheer volume, lethal capability, and availability (and entitled attitudes) have reached a pathetic level that does not seem sustainable.
My heart is forever in the Shire.
- RoseMorninStar
- Posts: 12897
- Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:07 am
- Location: North Shire
Re: Gun Control Debate
What makes the AR-15 style rifle the weapon of choice for mass shooters? From 60 Minutes (Nov. 4 2018)
There is also the NRA's comment to physicians to 'Stay in their lane' and the resulting backlash 'This is my lane'.
There is also the NRA's comment to physicians to 'Stay in their lane' and the resulting backlash 'This is my lane'.
My heart is forever in the Shire.
- elengil
- Cat-egorical Herbitual Creativi-Tea
- Posts: 6248
- Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:45 pm
- Location: Between the Mountains and the Sea
Re: Gun Control Debate
Here's another one - the 'good guy with a gun' is the one who got shot by police.RoseMorninStar wrote:What makes the AR-15 style rifle the weapon of choice for mass shooters? From 60 Minutes (Nov. 4 2018)
There is also the NRA's comment to physicians to 'Stay in their lane' and the resulting backlash 'This is my lane'.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-46187460
The dumbest thing I've ever bought
was a 2020 planner.
"Does anyone ever think about Denethor, the guy driven to madness by staying up late into the night alone in the dark staring at a flickering device he believed revealed unvarnished truth about the outside word, but which in fact showed mostly manipulated media created by a hostile power committed to portraying nothing but bad news framed in the worst possible way in order to sap hope, courage, and the will to go on? Seems like he's someone we should think about." - Dave_LF
was a 2020 planner.
"Does anyone ever think about Denethor, the guy driven to madness by staying up late into the night alone in the dark staring at a flickering device he believed revealed unvarnished truth about the outside word, but which in fact showed mostly manipulated media created by a hostile power committed to portraying nothing but bad news framed in the worst possible way in order to sap hope, courage, and the will to go on? Seems like he's someone we should think about." - Dave_LF
Re: Gun Control Debate
Oh, dear lord.
If there was anything that depressed him more than his own cynicism, it was that quite often it still wasn't as cynical as real life.
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
- RoseMorninStar
- Posts: 12897
- Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:07 am
- Location: North Shire
Re: Gun Control Debate
elengil wrote:
Here's another one - the 'good guy with a gun' is the one who got shot by police.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-46187460
My heart is forever in the Shire.
Re: Gun Control Debate
Nice to see a hopeful editorial on this subject!
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/artic ... XBik6pSrI8
https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/artic ... XBik6pSrI8
When the night has been too lonely, and the road has been too long,
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
And you think that love is only for the lucky and the strong,
Just remember in the winter far beneath the bitter snows,
Lies the seed, that with the sun's love, in the spring becomes The Rose.
- RoseMorninStar
- Posts: 12897
- Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2007 11:07 am
- Location: North Shire
Re: Gun Control Debate
What are the odds indeed. Sadly, the odds are increasing.The second striking thing about the Thousand Oaks massacre was the presence of survivors of that Las Vegas shooting. One Las Vegas survivor died in Thousand Oaks. What are the odds?
My heart is forever in the Shire.
Re: Gun Control Debate
A hospital this time. A doctor shot by her ex, who also killed two other people.
If there was anything that depressed him more than his own cynicism, it was that quite often it still wasn't as cynical as real life.
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!