Brexit Carried - Endgame
- Voronwë the Faithful
- At the intersection of here and now
- Posts: 46194
- Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:41 am
- Contact:
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
I should clarify my earlier post. As the video that Túrin posted describes, the vote that took place today was not a vote of no-confidence specifically about May, it was a vote of no-confidence about her government, which is different than the vote that took place last month, which was a vote about her by her party.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
Do we have that in the US?
If there was anything that depressed him more than his own cynicism, it was that quite often it still wasn't as cynical as real life.
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
- Primula Baggins
- Living in hope
- Posts: 40005
- Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:43 am
- Location: Sailing the luminiferous aether
- Contact:
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
I wish. It's a parliamentary thing, though.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
- elengil
- Cat-egorical Herbitual Creativi-Tea
- Posts: 6248
- Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:45 pm
- Location: Between the Mountains and the Sea
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
Kinda?? I mean, there's 25th Amendment...
The dumbest thing I've ever bought
was a 2020 planner.
"Does anyone ever think about Denethor, the guy driven to madness by staying up late into the night alone in the dark staring at a flickering device he believed revealed unvarnished truth about the outside word, but which in fact showed mostly manipulated media created by a hostile power committed to portraying nothing but bad news framed in the worst possible way in order to sap hope, courage, and the will to go on? Seems like he's someone we should think about." - Dave_LF
was a 2020 planner.
"Does anyone ever think about Denethor, the guy driven to madness by staying up late into the night alone in the dark staring at a flickering device he believed revealed unvarnished truth about the outside word, but which in fact showed mostly manipulated media created by a hostile power committed to portraying nothing but bad news framed in the worst possible way in order to sap hope, courage, and the will to go on? Seems like he's someone we should think about." - Dave_LF
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
The closest equivalent would be whatever mechanisms are used to remove the leadership in Congress. The 25th amendment would be a way to rid the US of her head of state. So would impeachment.
When you can do nothing what can you do?
- elengil
- Cat-egorical Herbitual Creativi-Tea
- Posts: 6248
- Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:45 pm
- Location: Between the Mountains and the Sea
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
Is May not considered a head of state?River wrote:The closest equivalent would be whatever mechanisms are used to remove the leadership in Congress. The 25th amendment would be a way to rid the US of her head of state. So would impeachment.
The dumbest thing I've ever bought
was a 2020 planner.
"Does anyone ever think about Denethor, the guy driven to madness by staying up late into the night alone in the dark staring at a flickering device he believed revealed unvarnished truth about the outside word, but which in fact showed mostly manipulated media created by a hostile power committed to portraying nothing but bad news framed in the worst possible way in order to sap hope, courage, and the will to go on? Seems like he's someone we should think about." - Dave_LF
was a 2020 planner.
"Does anyone ever think about Denethor, the guy driven to madness by staying up late into the night alone in the dark staring at a flickering device he believed revealed unvarnished truth about the outside word, but which in fact showed mostly manipulated media created by a hostile power committed to portraying nothing but bad news framed in the worst possible way in order to sap hope, courage, and the will to go on? Seems like he's someone we should think about." - Dave_LF
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
No. The Queen is head of state. May's the head of government.
When you can do nothing what can you do?
- elengil
- Cat-egorical Herbitual Creativi-Tea
- Posts: 6248
- Joined: Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:45 pm
- Location: Between the Mountains and the Sea
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
I really wish I understood Parliamentary government better
The dumbest thing I've ever bought
was a 2020 planner.
"Does anyone ever think about Denethor, the guy driven to madness by staying up late into the night alone in the dark staring at a flickering device he believed revealed unvarnished truth about the outside word, but which in fact showed mostly manipulated media created by a hostile power committed to portraying nothing but bad news framed in the worst possible way in order to sap hope, courage, and the will to go on? Seems like he's someone we should think about." - Dave_LF
was a 2020 planner.
"Does anyone ever think about Denethor, the guy driven to madness by staying up late into the night alone in the dark staring at a flickering device he believed revealed unvarnished truth about the outside word, but which in fact showed mostly manipulated media created by a hostile power committed to portraying nothing but bad news framed in the worst possible way in order to sap hope, courage, and the will to go on? Seems like he's someone we should think about." - Dave_LF
- Primula Baggins
- Living in hope
- Posts: 40005
- Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:43 am
- Location: Sailing the luminiferous aether
- Contact:
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
It's really hard to get rid of kings and queens. Maybe that's why they've persisted into modern times.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
India has a parliamentary system devoid of kings & queens. They exist, but have to fend on their own now.
An Indian’s perspective on Brexit:
https://nyti.ms/2RWEZsY?smid=nytcore-ios-share
An Indian’s perspective on Brexit:
https://nyti.ms/2RWEZsY?smid=nytcore-ios-share
'You just said "your getting shorter": you've obviously been drinking too much ent-draught and not enough Prim's.' - Jude
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
Ve haff vays.Primula Baggins wrote:It's really hard to get rid of kings and queens. Maybe that's why they've persisted into modern times.
If there was anything that depressed him more than his own cynicism, it was that quite often it still wasn't as cynical as real life.
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
- Primula Baggins
- Living in hope
- Posts: 40005
- Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:43 am
- Location: Sailing the luminiferous aether
- Contact:
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
*blanches*
Uh, yeah....
Uh, yeah....
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
It was just one tsar, it's not like it was a habit*
* Pratchett reference
* Pratchett reference
If there was anything that depressed him more than his own cynicism, it was that quite often it still wasn't as cynical as real life.
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
Terry Pratchett, Guards! Guards!
- Túrin Turambar
- Posts: 6153
- Joined: Sat Dec 03, 2005 9:37 am
- Location: Melbourne, Victoria
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
Keeping in mind this system was invented by the same people who came up with pounds-shillings-pence currency, cricket, and the English language –elengil wrote: I really wish I understood Parliamentary government better
1. All power was originally held by the sovereign, and even today the executive power in a country with the Queen as head of state is referred to as “the Crown” (e.g. criminal trials are traditionally written as R v Smith, “the Crown against Smith”).
2. With the Glorious Revolution in 1688, Parliament established itself as the supreme legislative authority. In other words, to be valid a law needed to be passed by parliament and then given royal assent by the sovereign.
3. Over time, the convention developed that the sovereign would only exercise his or her power on the advice of his or her ministers.
4. Ministers must be a member of Parliament and must maintain the confidence of Parliament. The Queen may only appoint someone as a minister if they have the confidence of parliament, and if they lose a no-confidence vote, they must resign. This state of affairs is referred to as responsible government, as the government is responsible to the parliament.
5. Historically, the House of Lords was more powerful and influential than the House of Commons. This changed over time, particularly following a constitutional crisis in 1910-1911, and since then the House of Commons has had responsibility for the expenditure of public money, and is hence the more powerful house.
6. With political parties, this means that the Queen will always appoint the people chosen by the political party or coalition of political parties which are able to get a majority of the votes in the House of Commons as her ministers. They will advise her collectively, as a cabinet. From memory, the last time a king tried to appoint a cabinet which did not have the confidence of the House of Commons was in 1830. This triggered a constitutional crisis, and since then the convention has been maintained.
7. The prime minister doesn’t actually have any formal or legal role in all this. In the 18th century, the convention began of having a ‘first minister’ who led the cabinet in its dealings with the sovereign, and of this person also holding the office of First Lord of the Treasury. The term ‘prime minister’ was originally given as a joke, and wasn’t used formally until 1905. The executive power originates from the sovereign and is exercised by the cabinet. As an aside, the words ‘prime minister’ do not appear in the Australian Constitution for the same reason.
8. Ministers have individual and collective responsibility to parliament. Parliament can pass a vote of no-confidence in one minister, and that minister must resign. Conversely, parliament can also pass a vote of no-confidence in the entire government. If this happens, the prime minister must advise the Queen to appoint someone else to form a government, or, if no other person can command the confidence of the House of Commons, to dissolve parliament and call an election.
9. If the government loses an election then it is held to have lost the confidence of parliament, and the prime minister will advise the Queen to send for the leader of the opposition. This is sometimes straightforward (as in 1997) but at other times complex when the result is unclear (as in 2010).
10. The prime minister may also be removed by her own party. This isn’t a formal mechanism for removing the prime minister, but flows on from the fact that the prime minister is the leader of the party in government, and the party in government has its own internal rules about who gets to be its leader, so if someone loses a vote to be party leader under the party’s rules it stands to reason that they’ve lost the confidence of the House.
I’m not sure if it’s “really hard” so much as “not worth the trouble if there doesn’t seem to be any problem with keeping them”. There have been bouts of such removals in times of upheaval, like 1917-1920.Primula Baggins wrote:It's really hard to get rid of kings and queens. Maybe that's why they've persisted into modern times.
- Voronwë the Faithful
- At the intersection of here and now
- Posts: 46194
- Joined: Mon Nov 21, 2005 1:41 am
- Contact:
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
Al (or anyone else), any thoughts about this?
https://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKCN1PE0W0
Sent from my LG G6 using Tapatalk
https://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKCN1PE0W0
Sent from my LG G6 using Tapatalk
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
I don't think she has a snowball's chance in hell. I'm disturbed she's even considering it.
The Vinyamars on Stage! This time at Bag End
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
I can't believe how uninformed and unintelligible your President is. He keeps lowering the bar. This is pure stream of conscious gibberish.
https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=2329627550387423
https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=2329627550387423
The Vinyamars on Stage! This time at Bag End
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
The link isn't working for me.
I wanna love somebody but I don't know how
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
That's strange, it still works for me?
The Vinyamars on Stage! This time at Bag End
Re: Brexit Carried - Deal Defeated
Its from a few months back. This version isn't even as bad as the original clip where he has no clue what a "Hard Brexit" means and thinks they said "Heartbreaking". He then starts rambling about how there were protests, but that was the same at the election, and he won 306 electoral seats including Wisconsin, which Reagan didn't win, and by the way I have a place in Ireland too and they love me there and they agree with me on immigration which is why Brexit happened...
The Vinyamars on Stage! This time at Bag End