LotR: What do you dislike about the Books?

Seeking knowledge in, of, and about Middle-earth.
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kindred spirit
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Post by kindred spirit »

My love affair with LOTR does tend to wax and wane. There are points in my life when I could use lines such as "if by my life or death I can save you I will" (book and movie line by the way!)

At other times "I am Aragorn son of Arathorn heir of Elendil yada yada yada....." makes the modern gal in me cringe. I guess there is a limit on my Victoriana-o-meter. :P


Primula_Baggins wrote: LotR has mystery. There are things we aren't told. There are things we see hints of, but no more. There are inconsistencies as maddening as any in real life. The borders are hazy and you can see things moving in the distance, but you can't make them out. Even the ending, the ultimate fates of all the main characters, is cloaked in "It is said."

You could live there for a lifetime and not explore a fraction of it.
Primula, my favorite comment in this thread! Sometimes I love to just ponder the inconsistent mystery of it all. That's when I get to use MY imagination.
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axordil
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Post by axordil »

KS, you've put your finger on the underlying reason why the flower stuff and the stiff end of the poetry get to me...the uber-Victorian sensibility they both convey. Quite a bit of the Sil suffers from it too, but not the best parts...the Nin i Hin Húrin of course pops to mind.

When JRRT pushes THROUGH the tea party stuff into the genuinely medieval or the nakedly fantastic, he's at his best.
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yovargas
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Post by yovargas »

One thing that's amazed me for a while is...I got on TORC about a year before the movie came out. During that time I think every single aspect of book-to-movie translation was discussed, virtually every change, omission, or addition. But I don't think that once - not once! - did I ever hear anybody mention the Ghân-buri-Ghân omission. It's almost as if people pretend they don't exist. I wonder why? My theory: they're pretty lame.
I wanna love somebody but I don't know how
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists

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Primula Baggins
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Post by Primula Baggins »

I'm sure Ghân-buri-Ghân has fans!

But perhaps they communicate largely in grunts and gestures, which are not well adapted to messageboards.
“There, peeping among the cloud-wrack above a dark tor high up in the mountains, Sam saw a white star twinkle for a while. The beauty of it smote his heart, as he looked up out of the forsaken land, and hope returned to him. For like a shaft, clear and cold, the thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was only a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty for ever beyond its reach.”
― J.R.R. Tolkien, The Return of the King
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superwizard
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Post by superwizard »

Your right, I haven't heard anyone mention the Ghân-buri-Ghân ommision. I like Ghân-buri-Ghân, I guess I just never realized he was omitted...
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axordil
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Post by axordil »

That alone should tell you something. :D
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yovargas
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Post by yovargas »

And it's not like they're some tiny blurb. They take up a decent size chunk of a chapter or two. Certainly they take up more space then Arwen!
I wanna love somebody but I don't know how
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
-The Decemberists

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superwizard
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Post by superwizard »

I guess it is because the story can pretty much go pretty smoothly with or without him.
Last edited by superwizard on Fri May 12, 2006 10:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Voronwë the Faithful
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

I like the Woses (Ghân-buri-Ghân is, of course, an individual character, The headman of the Woses of Drúadan Forest at the time of the War of the Ring, not the name of the Woses in general) in the book.

They would have been disastrous to include in the film.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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superwizard
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Post by superwizard »

Yes they would have V but the point is no one really noticed they were gone!!
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Post by Sassafras »

Yes but they aren't as pretty!

Think on how PJ might have portrayed Ghân-buri-Ghân ... and be grateful for the omission.

:D
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Ever mindful of the maxim that brevity is the soul of wit, axordil sums up the Sil:


"Too many Fingolfins, not enough Sams."

Yes.
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yovargas
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Post by yovargas »

superwizard wrote:I guess it is because the story can pretty much go pretty smoothly with or without him.
Which is likely why I find them :ysleepy: in the book.
I wanna love somebody but I don't know how
I wanna throw my body in the river and drown
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Voronwë the Faithful
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

superwizard wrote:Yes they would have V but the point is no one really noticed they were gone!!
Sure we did. In m00bies we talked about everything. We discussed Ghân when this horrible thing came out:

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"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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superwizard
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Post by superwizard »

Why did they make him look like that????? That's awful
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

sw, as my old mentor, Babatunde Olatunji once said, "some questions should never be asked, and would be useless, if known."
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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vison
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Post by vison »

Eeeeps. Looks like . . . . . Billy Idol!!!! Mygawd.

No.

Wait.

It just struck me, and this is not a joke: he looks like the young Darth Vader,whatshisname, Hayden Christensen? (Not sure of the spelling.) Yes, he looks just like that, when he started practicing his glowering and frowning.

I didn't miss Ghân-buri-Ghân at all, come to think of it. Never noticed until just this minute. Yet he's in one of my fanfics.

*sigh*

Yes, 'tis best he was left out.
Dig deeper.
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superwizard
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Post by superwizard »

Good point V, very good point
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Post by Erunáme »

For V and Jude (and any other interested others): http://www.thehalloffire.net/forum/view ... 5521#25521
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Voronwë the Faithful
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Post by Voronwë the Faithful »

Thanks, Eru, I saw that. :) I plan to check it out later when I go home and can download the program.
"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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Old_Tom_Bombadil
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Post by Old_Tom_Bombadil »

Would you know it? This thread is supposed to be about what we don't like about the books and we're all going on and on about what we do like! :rofl:

Athrabeth wrote:I just :love: alliterative verse.
Me, too! :)
Alatar wrote: As for Bill Nighy's delivery of "Gil-Galad was an Elven King".... sw00000n.
I agree. Bill Nighy is an awesome Samwise (the Strong ;) ), and his singing on Weathertop is particularly great.

truehobbit wrote:As to "silly", I think Tom's "silliness" isn't silly at all - it just appears silly to us who consider ourselves accomplished and worldly-wise and all that.
It's like it says about Tom's unintellegible sing-song, which in fact are words from an ancient language, "whose words were mainly those of wonder and surprise" - one of my favourite lines in the book - I think Tom isn't silly, he's just uncorrupted, and as such must appear silly to us.
At last someone who understands! I've always said that Hobby is wise beyond her years. :bow:
yovargas wrote: But I don't think that once - not once! - did I ever hear anybody mention the Ghân-buri-Ghân omission.
Sure, I noticed it. Poor GBG always gets left out of dramatizations, just like a certain inhabitant of the Old Forest. But then I'm particuarly sensitive to such things. :whistle:
vison wrote:Eeeeps. Looks like . . . . . Billy Idol!!!! Mygawd.
Thanks, vison. Now I have "White Wedding" going through my head. :roll:

Hey little sister what have you done
Hey little sister who's the only one
Hey little sister who's your superman
Hey little sister who's the one you want
Hey little sister shot gun!
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