The Cinemacon footage

[Elentári]

I can't see how to work in the "liberty" that seems to be being taken with the Nazgûl tombs business within the history of M-e...

At the Battle of Fornost, Glorfindel watched the Witch King flee into the darkness at Angmar, making his famous prophecy, then the WiKi later resurfaced in Gondor with the Nine, taking Minas Ithil for Sauron and indeed challenging Eärnur from there in TA 2050, 13 years before Gandalf drove Sauron out of Dol Guldur the first time. The Nazgûl then remained ensconced in Minas Morgul for the main part, with at least two stationed in DG, until they rode forth to hunt for the Ring in 3018

How are we are supposed to believe instead that said WiKi was buried in a tomb/sepulchre which was sealed with supposedly unbreakable seals which the Necromancer was able to break...

Oh, silly me, I forgot, this is a film adaptation...

[Alatar]

Purists...

P.S. Any chance we can import that smiley?

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I think we need to wait and see how it really plays out before judging it. But I definitely have an open mind about it. It certainly is not in the "Frodo sending Sam home" realm, nor is it as bad as some of the liberties that I have imagined them doing in expanding the Dol Guldur/White Council/Necromancer plot line.

Al, I'll get on it. I think we might have more and more need for that smiley as the films get closer. [Edit: Done.]

[Elentári]

Seriously, I don't mind liberties...I just like to be able to make them work logically within the canonical framework...even roughly!

for what it's worth, I'm sure I will still enjoy the films, though!

[CosmicBob]

Another article about the same thing:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/2 ... 52391.html

[WampusCat]

From the EW article:

We then see Gandalf visiting said tomb, a kind of vertical mineshaft with caged crypts that have been ripped open. This is the tomb of the witch kings, seen in The Lord of the Rings trilogy as the black, spectral wringwraiths. In this tomb, Gandalf meets the brown wizard, Radagast, played by Sylvester McCoy, who has three little birds who live under his hat — and occasionally drop poop down his beard. (This is where the HD really pays off, people!)

Wringwraiths?

Bird poop on a wizard's beard?


Mercy.

[Elentári]

"wringwraiths????" Why do I now have visions of 9 Uriah Heeps muttering about being "ever so 'umble?"


Meanwhile, there's a great thread over on TORn on 4K Resolution in which Owain gives some really helpful insights into the 48ps Hobbit footage controversy:

I have been trained by RED Digital Cinema to use the RED Epic.

Later this year, I hope to own one... working on it.

Resolution is key, as is bit depth, the wavelet compression that RED RAW files use, how REDCODE RAW files look coming directly out of the camera vs. film etc. etc.

It is true that at these higher resolutions and bit depths the camera can be more unforgiving. But the information that is being captured does allow for manipulation in post that film could never touch. The higher frame rates are providing realistic motion without blurring.

As an editor by trade, I have seen first hand the RAW files that come from the RED camera are they are incredible... so much so that I believe, they (RED) have single handedly revolutionized the world of cinema. They were the first and are arguably the best in D-Cinema.

Peter Jackson is shooting 5K resolution, 16 bit RAW .r3d files (bit depth supplies a massive amount of information for detail) at 5:1 compression at 48fps and higher.

He is oversampling or getting way more information than he needs from his RED Epics.

The reason... the widest latitude possible in post.

When you shoot with a RED camera the RAW data (if properly exposed) actually looks flat. This is purposeful. The key is to properly expose. The RED camera is incredible in low light. The deep dark areas retain all of the detail even with limited to no lighting. This is something film was never really that great at. It is the highlights that DPs have to be careful with.

When taken into the Pablo finishing software, the amount of detail provided by those RED RAW (.r3d files) is virtually limitless.

From my knowledge of the camera and post workflow, I am going to go out on a limb and say that the content at CinemaCon was not meant to give people an accurate view of the final rendering, but to get them used to the idea of the 48fps - strictly from a motion standpoint.

It will be different than what people are used to seeing. It will be better than the fake higher frame rates that tv's offer. Why? Put simply TVs interpolate or create frames that never existed. They are constructed from algorithms that give you the idea but not the real effect. The frames that will be projected for The Hobbit were actually captured by the cameras and will be projected without any interpolation.

So why the negative reactions?

In my opinion:

A. Human nature likes gradual instead of major/abrupt change
B. People had a set of specific expectations going into the screening
C. Ultimately what they saw was not the finished product

I think that PJ is going for something beyond film and beyond TV.

This will be something that, truly, we have not seen before.

And that is polarizing to be sure. I find it exciting.

It remains to be seen whether audiences will buy into the idea or not.

I have high hopes for it.

[eborr]

Giant Bunnies, undead, clearly a homage to the Wallace and Gromit epic, lets's face it PJ has always been one for acknowledging cinematic icons

[Primula Baggins]

eborr,

Elen, thanks for posting that. These incredibly powerful digital cameras are taking cinematography in a new direction. Instead of having to be extremely careful to capture something as close to the final image they want as possible, they simply capture everything and extract what they want in post. That's where most of the cinematography happens.

As in so many other fields, more work will be accruing to people sitting in dark rooms in front of computer monitors.

[Dave_LF]

Hey; my room has lights!

[Primula Baggins]

So does mine, but our work isn't entirely visual and contained on the screen.

[Elentári]

Okay...Quickbeam's full report on the CinemaCon Hobbit footage is now up on TORn.

He does a good job of describing the scenes shown, and putting some of the more controversal content in context...

I’m not remembering these clips in the correct order they were shown, but we also see a brief shot of Radagast being pulled along the forest floor in a sled drawn by mighty grey jackrabbits! I kid you not, it was a ramshackle version of an Iditarod dogsled, made of twisted branches and bracken, pulled by six or seven oversized rabbits. I think it was Radagast, but he went by so fast — what other character could it be? And this point the filmmakers are making a complete departure from Tolkien but it honestly doesn’t bother me. I like the idea that the writers and WETA’s clever artists can come up with something wholly new. It seems quite silly on paper, but it’s also whimsical enough to fit in nicely with the tone of The Hobbit book. It’s definitely no sillier than a line-up of farm animals setting up a feast and doing catering service in Beorn’s house, is it?

[CosmicBob]

...but we also see a brief shot of Radagast being pulled along the forest floor in a sled drawn by mighty grey jackrabbits!

...

It seems quite silly on paper, but it’s also whimsical enough to fit in nicely with the tone of The Hobbit book. It’s definitely no sillier than a line-up of farm animals setting up a feast and doing catering service in Beorn’s house, is it?

He's got a point here. It's not absurd in the context of The Hobbit. It would be in LOTR. Also remember big swans pulled the Teleri boats around in The Simarillion

[Dave_LF]

The idea of rabbits pulling a sled is consistent with the tone of the book, IMO. But why a sled? Is there snow? Are there historical examples of animal-powered sleds or sledges carrying a wizardweight across anything else? As a mode of transportation?

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Here is Quickbeam's official write-up:

Hobbit Footage Review & MASSIVE SPOILERS: Full Coverage & Analysis!

[Frelga]

Does that sound like Del Toro to anyone? I'm not an expert on him, it just doesn't sound like PJ to me.

[Alatar]

Psst, Voronwë, Elen just posted that a few posts up.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

Whoops.

[Elentári]

Not again! Am I posting with invisible ink or something????

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I thought I just heard something. What was that?