Cast Speculation

[Primula Baggins]

I was also wondering whether you'd heard something specific, Voronwë.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

No, if I had heard something, I would say so, as I always do. But the suggestion makes no sense, from a movie point of view. Why would the king of the Woodland realm travel to Rivendell, join the Fellowship, and never once have it be mentioned that he was the king of woodland realm? On the contrary, he is specifically introduced by Aragorn to Éomer as "Legolas of the woodland realm." That would make no sense at all if he was actually the king of the woodland realm.

[Dave_LF]

That introduction is a bit insufficient for a Prince of the woodland realm too, but they obviously weren't interested in complicating things by throwing that little detail in.

But having Legolas be the king was just one of the possibilities mentioned; the idea that he could be the senior officer in charge of handling the dwarves is interesting too.

[SirDennis]

Having said all that, are you sure you won't reconsider my position on Figwit?

You are right, it would make no sense. I just got a chill thinking they would have to dub over Aragorn's introduction.

[Alatar]

I don't think he'll be Thranduil, but is it possible that the Elvenking is not Thranduil, but Legolas?

You asked a question, and I answered it. In my opinion, the chances of them making Legolas the Elvenking is zero. I don't see anything wrong with that.

I do.

I asked if it was possible. You said no.

You didn't offer an opinion, or indeed any reasoned argument. You simply dismissed it as impossible when it clearly is not.

I find that both arrogant and insulting.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I'm certainly sorry that you feel that way. But I continue to maintain that it simply is not a possibility that makes any sense. I'll leave it at that.

[SirDennis]

Leaving aside the questions of whether it is possible they could be so daft as to swap Thranduil for Legolas, or cast Bloom as his own father (which has happened in some films)...

The book is one thing, but PJ's choices are limited by what already exists in the LOTR movies as well. Yet serious speculation seems more and more resistant to this idea of late.

What are some reasons they might want to replace Thranduil with Legolas, or even Bard with Legolas? Would any of those reasons be acceptable to you?

[Elentári]

The main reason we are speculating seems to be because so far the part of Thranduil, (and of course, Bard,) hasn't been cast. but as V pointed out, Cate Blanchett wasn't announced as Galadriel till after filming began on LotR. I guess that Jackson either is holding out on the suspense factor, and maybe planning to get a "bigger" name for these two parts, or more simply because the actor(s) he wants have resisted signing for whatever reasons, such as other commitments, and details have yet to be worked out.

Thranduil's role is comparable at least to Galadriel's in LotR, slightly bigger, in fact. So I can't see it going to Legolas. Particularly since the character of Thranduil as written is rather at odds with the Legolas we know and love.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

As much as I hate the idea of Legolas replacing Bard, I would not deem it "impossible" on the same level that I consider making Legolas the Elvenking, because it wouldn't directly compromise the existing LOTR films in the same way. However, I would be quite surprised to see the filmmakers eliminating the one human hero in the story, so I'm not too worried about it happening. If it did happen, I would be upset enough that I would consider boycotting the films altgother (though of course I wouldn't actually go through with it).

[eborr]

look if they can do without Tom Bom, then no-one is safe. Maybe they have got some strange character arc in mind, where Legolas starts off as one of these tetchy woodland elves, but later changes character to that wooden elf we all know and love. Or perhaps a more radical idea, Thranduill has renounced his throne in favour of "democracy" - that would play well with western media

[Alatar]

To be clear, its not something I would like, but I do not think it as unlikely as others do. In the original two film treatment Denethor and Théoden were conflated into one character, a much bigger change than this would be.

Also, for clarification, I think it far less likely that Bloom would play Thranduil, and far more likely that Legolas, the Elven Prince, would take the role assigned to Thranduil in the books or a similar one, as his son.

Lets look at Arwen for example. She had no business whatsoever supplanting Glorfindel at the ford. Completely at odds with her Book character. Yet PJ & Co wanted a bigger role for her, so they gave her Glorfindel's moment.

Now we have a situation where they want a decent role for Orlando Bloom, and nobody has been cast in the fairly major role of Thranduil.

Just cause I'm paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get me.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

It's not a question of how big of a change from the book it is. That might make it distasteful from a purist point of view, but I certainly wouldn't rule it out for that reason. It's a question of it not making sense from the point of view of the existing films (which obviously is not the case for the examples that you give). That's why I don't consider it even a remote possibility.

[SirDennis]

@eborr: "no one is safe" Wait, that's not funny... because it's true!

It does set up Alatar's post nicely though...

@Alatar: You paint a compelling, yet nightmarish picture. Yet I don't think, in this case at least, that it is likely to happen.

It seems there is enough room to create a decent role for Legolas (since he was not mentioned in the book anyway) without messing up what we already know of him in LOTR (movie). That is unless they are trying to set the stage to completely re-make LOTR. (I'm guessing the rights were renewed and belong to PJ for another 10 years?)

[Voronwë the Faithful]

If I understand the complicated licence agreement that Saul Zaentz entered into to Miramax (and which was subsequently quitclaimed to New Line, and hence to WB), they would continue to have an option to make new films based on LOTR and/or The Hobbit so long as production begins within a certain number of years of the release of the second Hobbit films. Otherwise, the rights would revert completely to Zaentz (accept to the extent that MGM maintains distribution rights to The Hobbit). In any event, PJ himself holds no rights or options (though of course he would be a desirable director/producer to WB or any studio wanting to make Middle-earth films).

That having been said, I don't expect that there will be any attempt to remake LOTR within that time.

[SirDennis]

Thanks for clearing that up. In theory WB could have named any director they wanted... at their own peril of course. Interesting.

Going back to what Alatar said about sons playing fathers, this link was shared in an unrelated discussion: http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/showbiz/ce ... -23028149/

If he was being serious, Billy Boyd thought he might be able to play Pipin's father in TH. I wonder where this idea came from? I suppose just about any actor from LOTR could play their character's father in TH. Solves the question of why the actors might have looked older in the more recent movies.

I wonder if this was an option the production explored? They might be able to get away with it for one character, but more than that and it would be too much, a mockery in fact.

I wonder now if Bloom might be slated to play Legolas's father? I hate the idea, especially since there is no problem with the age difference of Legolas in the two texts. Hmmm

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I don't like the idea, but I wouldn't call it impossible. In terms of looks, I think they could pull off making Bloom look like Legolas's father. I just don't think that Bloom has the acting chops to play the kind of complicated character that the Elvenking should be.

[Elentári]

I do think we are barking up the wrong tree with this idea...why would the studio want Bloom to come back and play the "less interesting" (but more serious actorly role, perhaps) part of hs father, when the fangirls want more Legolas doing his impossible action stuff, and there is plenty of scope to expand his role in that way with scenes at DG and the Bo5A?

OTOH, it might be that Bloom wants to develop his character acting skills as he matures...

[Primula Baggins]

Maybe so, but I doubt it's up to him. And Legolas is the role that made him famous (relatively speaking), so it's a well worth revisiting as far as his career goes.

I don't think any role in an LotR-related blockbuster is going to get him serious acting cred; look at how few LotR actors got acting nominations (not just the Oscars, anywhere). And (IIRC) none of them won.

[Elentári]

not sure you got my point there, Prim....

I was trying to give Bloom the benefit of the doubt regarding the "serious" acting cred, whilst stating, as you have just done, that IMH, he would be better off playing Legolas in a beefed up role, rather than Thranduil!

[Primula Baggins]

Sorry. I thought I was pretty much agreeing with you!