Lies of the radical right

[River]

hal, kindly refrain from telling me how I think.

Thanks.

[yovargas]

This thread is not about the "tea party" movement.

[halplm]

hal, kindly refrain from telling me how I think.

Thanks.

Ah, but it's ok for people to tell the tea party how they think?

[River]

Who here is doing that? Last I checked this thread, we were talking about the tea party, not to it.

[halplm]

This thread is not about the "tea party" movement.

It is, as most people insulting those they disagree with these days target the tea party movement not the republicans.

And you titled it "lies of the radical right" not "lies of the republicans."

So if you would like to define who is or is not "radical right" perhaps that would help.

[halplm]

Who here is doing that? Last I checked this thread, we were talking about the tea party, not to it.

I give up. Carry on.

[River]

And now it looks like more moderate voices on the conservative side have had enough and are trying to dial the tone of political discourse back towards "civil": Murdoch rips competitors for bias even as more Fox critics emerge on the right

Yesterday, Oklahoma Sen. Tom Coburn, who is strongly identified with both the fiscal- and social-conservative wings of the GOP, wound up cautioning some conservative constituents at a town hall gathering not to "catch yourself being biased by Fox News that somebody is no good."

Coburn's plea for viewer skepticism came in defense of his courtly aside about Democratic House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, whom he characterized as "a nice person." When a wave of grumbling followed, Coburn stood his ground, asking the crowd "how many of you all have met her?" before proceeding to chide them for echoing the Fox-branded view of Pelosi as a poor specimen of humanity.

The Coburn episode was especially striking, since he happens to be one of the most stalwart conservatives in the Senate, netting a 96-point rating on the 100-point scale furnished by the American Conservative Union.
Other conservatives who are closer to the traditional GOP mainstream have lately raised similar red flags about Fox's broader political impact. David Frum, the former American Enterprise Institute fellow who was recently let go in the wake of a widely circulated blog post he wrote criticizing GOP legislative tactics on health care reform, has said that "Republicans originally thought that Fox worked for us, and now we're discovering that we're working for Fox." Frum spelled out what he meant by that remark in a weekend appearance on CNN's "Reliable Sources":
"What that means is that Fox, like Limbaugh, has an interest in pushing the Republicans to the margins, making people angry," he said. "When people are angry and alienated, they don't vote. They succumb to feelings of helplessness."

Bruce Bartlett, a Frum sympathizer, argues that the network's elevation as the premier source of conservative information has also closed the right off from healthy debate. "Fox News is a Republican, conservatively biased organization," Bartlett told Yahoo! News. "Now conservatives don't need to get into the New York Times, or on CBS. They've got their own news network, and all they really think is, 'How can I get a positive mention from Beck or Limbaugh?' or 'How can I get my boss onto Fox News?' "

Fox's Glenn Beck, indeed, spearheaded the Sept. 12 rally in Washington, D.C., that served as the national coming out moment for the Tea Party movement. The network was also instrumental in publicizing the first round of Tea Party protests over the stimulus law, which launched last April 15.

Those actions have sent the network's ratings through the roof — Beck, for one, is now the second highest rated host on cable news, behind only fellow conservative and Fox News host Bill O'Reilly. But the popular anger stirred up under the network's auspices may not be an unqualified boon to a GOP facing a tough primary season that pits many Tea Party-style insurgents against candidates aligned with the national party organization. Two of the most prominent such races are the Senate contests in Florida and Arizona, where two more compromise-minded mainstream candidates, Charlie Crist and John McCain, are fending off challenges from candidates backed by the Tea Party — and running strongly to the right of their usual positions as a result.

Beyond the primaries, the GOP is looking to make significant headway against the Democratic majorities in Congress — hoping even to return the House to Republican control. But to do that, Republicans will have to overcome their disadvantage in voter registration in many districts by appealing to independent voters — and those are the very sorts of voters most likely to be repelled by an angry ideological message.

Kevin Madden, a political consultant with the Washington-based firm Dyke Associates and former communications director for Mitt Romney's 2008 presidential bid, says that GOP leaders aren't yet voicing "widespread" concerns about the Fox message distorting the fall campaign. At the same time, however, Madden — a frequent commentator on the rival cable network CNN — praised Tom Coburn's candor.

"Mr. Coburn's remarks seem to reflect an admirable and rare belief that one can win a political debate by convincing those seated in the jury box of public opinion that an opponent has wrong ideas, without having to demonstrate that same opponent has corrupt intentions," Madden said.

I can only hope this push-back works. This "let's all freak out now" atmosphere that's been dominating this country for so many months, caused by the economic situation and exacerbated by the political one, is not doing anyone any good.

[Padme]

McCain and Crist are always welcome in the big ol' left wing liberal commie lovin evil tent We seem to be picking up a good deal slightly right of middle people lately.

[N.E. Brigand]

From a Washington Post report on a rally with Michelle Bachman and Sarah Palin:

Betty Soban, an admiring constituent of Bachmann's, said: "My family left Germany because of Hitler and socialized medicine. I see it happening here." Important to her, she said, are "freedom of ownership. Freedom of our guns. Freedom of having babies."

Soban's sweatshirt read "Liberty and Freedom," and she sported a button that said: "Change? I'd like mine back."

But of course, while Soban's comments are worth a chuckle (which Democratic policies prevent people from having children?), presumably they don't represent the views of most Bachmann or Palin supporters.

[Túrin Turambar]

Betty Soban, an admiring constituent of Bachmann's, said: "My family left Germany because of Hitler and socialized medicine."

There's honestly nothing I can say in response to that.

[vison]

Betty Soban, an admiring constituent of Bachmann's, said: "My family left Germany because of Hitler and socialized medicine."

There's honestly nothing I can say in response to that.

Ignorance on that level is staggering. You're right, Lord_M, there is nothing anyone can say about it.

[nerdanel]

Betty Soban, an admiring constituent of Bachmann's, said: "My family left Germany because of Hitler and socialized medicine."

There's honestly nothing I can say in response to that.

Hmm, I'd been looking for a word to call this. I'd come up with lots of adjectives, like evil, immoral, unethical, sinful, condemnable, outrageous, despicable, unconscionable, etc. But now I see that it's so much better described with an adjective plus a noun: socialized medicine.

[Túrin Turambar]

Betty Soban, an admiring constituent of Bachmann's, said: "My family left Germany because of Hitler and socialized medicine."

There's honestly nothing I can say in response to that.

Hmm, I'd been looking for a word to call this. I'd come up with lots of adjectives, like evil, immoral, unethical, sinful, condemnable, outrageous, despicable, unconscionable, etc. But now I see that it's so much better described with an adjective plus a noun: socialized medicine.

I thought of a few adjectives and nouns but the board software wouldn't let me post them. I think that end the end, though, it just speaks for itself.

[River]

I'm gonna go reboot my brain now. BRB.

[WampusCat]

Truly horrifying. And I mean that of both the original event and Soban's comments. Although I'm sure that there are plenty of people who think that's exactly the sort of thing Obamacare would do. Remember "death panels"?

Sigh.

[nerdanel]

Although I'm sure that there are plenty of people who think that's exactly the sort of thing Obamacare would do. Remember "death panels"?

(unless I'm missing something, I thought that was the analogy she was trying to draw, hence my remarks. Am I giving her too much credit?)

[WampusCat]

You're probably right. I just suspect (unjustly, perhaps) that phrases such as "Hitler" and "socialized medicine" are being thrown around these days in the same way "liberal" has been -- as generalized insults, without thought as to whether they are connected or applicable to the policy or person being attacked.

I am not saying that everyone who opposes the Obama health care plan thinks this way. Just some of the more extreme critics.

[Voronwë the Faithful]

I am quite sure that it would be just as easy to mock some liberal supporter of some liberal cause.

Politics suck.

[Hachimitsu]

Thanks Nerdanel for posting that. Now I understand to some degree why some people think public health care is a bad thing. Although I think types of governments should be considered and accounted for. Nothing even slightly like that would happen in Canada.

Also if Americans think that sort of thing would happen in the US, if some kind of health care was offered to everybody I think those Americans are selling themselves and their country short. (Have some faith your population peoples!!)

[Alatar]

Hardly Wilma!

If there's one thing I've learned from reading these debates, its that all Democrats are Commie Socialists who want to hand over all their money and freedoms to the government while sitting on death panels cause they hate the military, and that all Republicans are gun totin' capitalists who want to starve the poor and have medicine only for the rich while removing government and paying no tax despite wanting the biggest army in the world.

Or did I miss something?