War between Hamas and Israel

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N.E. Brigand
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

Post by N.E. Brigand »

I forgot about this bit of information from another thread until just now:
N.E. Brigand wrote: Thu Sep 15, 2022 1:23 am This is not a case as such, but according to a new book, President Trump shocked King Abdullah II of Jordan in 2018 by telling him that he would give the West Bank, the Palestinian territories that have been occupied by Israel since 1967, back to Jordan, which controlled the area until that time.
Worth remembering for those who claim that Joe Biden's and Donald Trump's approaches to Israeli-Palestinian affairs are interchangeable.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

Post by N.E. Brigand »

Just too much news to keep up with over the past day. As pertains to this thread, that includes (1) the United Nation's International Court of Justice ruling that some acts alleged to have been committed by Israel could be genocide and (2) the U.N. announcing that it would be punishing a dozen members of its Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) who were in involved in Hamas's Oct. 7th attack; this was followed by several countries including the U.S. saying that they would suspend payments to UNRWA.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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The Wall Street Journal reports on intelligence indicating that approximately 10% of UNRWA employees are operative either of Hamas or Islamic Jihad, and some UNRWA workers were directly involved in killing or kidnapping Israelis on Oct. 7th. Since the group's members are largely men, which actually means that a higher percentage of men working for UNRWA are part of those groups than is true of the men in Gaza as a whole. Also in the report: Hamas has stolen about $1 million in U.N. relief meant to succor the Palestinian people just since Oct. 7th. The European Commission has now suspended its funding of UNRWA pending a fuller investigation.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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Josh Marshall writes at Talking Points Memo that the story of entanglements between Hamas and UNRWA "is both more and less than it seems." I found Marshall's piece to be quite useful in better understanding the whole Israel-Gaza situation. For example, UNRWA:
was founded in 1949 to administer refugee camps for the hundreds of thousands of Palestinians who had either fled the fighting or were driven out by the Israeli military during both phases of the Israeli War of Independence, what Palestinians call The Nakba. (Most of this happened during the first phase of the war.) There were camps in Gaza, the West Bank, Lebanon, Syria and Jordan. Those camps are still there 75 years later. “Camps” is a misnomer. Over time permanent buildings replaced temporary structures and tents. Schools, hospitals, civic buildings and businesses grew up. They are more like towns, or districts of towns. The vast majority of residents of the camps are third and fourth generation descendants of the original refugees of 1947-48. Under UNRWA’s framework they are also refugees. UNRWA still plays a central role administering these communities — running schools, hospitals, various civil services.

The UN has an entirely different agency for supporting and resettling refugees, the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees. Its mandate covers the entire globe except for Palestine, or rather refugees and descendants of refugees who were living in Mandatory Palestine in 1947-48. Those come under the mandate of UNRWA.

UNRWA’s mandate is also different. Its mandate is to run the camps, not to resettle refugees, as UNHCR does. The logic of this arrangement is that the outcome of the 1948 war is considered unsettled. To put this in slightly different terms there are more than 5 million UNRWA registered Palestinian refugees (including both refugees and descendants of refugees) either living in UNRWA camps or eligible for UNRWA services on the premise that they will one day return to what is now Israel.
And despite the "U.N." in the name, UNRWA has long been a semi-independent body and "a Palestinian entity. As such it's a cross-section of Palestinian society. Of course it has Hamas sympathizers and operatives among its employees. It would be shocking if it didn't. ... And you know what one country won’t cut off cooperation with UNRWA? Israel ... because it’s the only infrastructure for providing basic services to much of the population in the occupied territories."

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Somehow I completely forgot that Donald Trump moved the U.S. Embassy in Israel from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem, which in the long run probably wasn't that important but which was definitely presented as a show of U.S. support for Israel over Palestine.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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David Friedman, who was the U.S. Ambassador to Israel for most of Donald Trump's presidency, "has accused U.S. President Joe Biden of hampering Israel's war effort and said that the president's charge last month of indiscriminate bombing by Israel in Gaza was 'an outright lie'," adding that Biden's commitment to Israel has "faded" since Oct. 7th.

Donald Trump has argued that members of Congress who support Palestinian rights should be expelled and that universities that won't ban anti-Israel protests should have their funding cut.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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A few days ago, Israeli commandos disguised as doctors killed three patients they said were three Hamas leaders in a Gaza hospital.

I think that's better than just bombing the whole hospital.

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Axios reported yesterday that the "State Department is reviewing options for possible recognition of Palestinian state."

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Earlier today, there was reporting that President Biden is "expected to issue an executive order aimed at punishing West Bank Israeli settlers who have attacked Palestinians in the occupied territory." When that order was published later in the day, one commentator called it "a big deal … by far the most expansive anti-settler extremism act taken by an American president … Biden just created financial risk for any institution doing business with violent West Bank extremists, and that's going to create a significant deterrent effect beyond just individual extremists who get sanctioned." And apparently it puts Benjamin Netanyahu in a bind because these settlers are some of his strongest supporters but unpopular in Israel overall.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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In a Wall Street Journal interview, far-right Israeli politician Itamar Ben-Gvir complains that U.S. President Joe Biden is "hampering" Israel, that Donald Trump "would give Israel a freer hand to quash Hamas," and that "Biden is busy with giving humanitarian aid" to Gazans.

Current estimates are that 27,000 Gazans and 1,400 Israelis have been killed since (and including) the Oct. 7th massacre. If Ben-Gvir is right, I wonder how much higher that first number would be if Donald Trump were U.S. President now. As I mentioned before, Republican Congressman Max Miller, whose district extends to within a few miles of my home, said in October that Israel should suspend the rules of war and turn Gaza into a "parking lot."
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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In Haaretz, an opinion essay by Gershon Baskin, who negotiated a 2011 Hamas/Israel cease-fire (that traded 1,000 Hamas prisoners for one Israeli soldier):

"A Cease-fire Deal Would Be a Huge Victory for Hamas, but Israel Has No Choice."

Baskin writes that he hoped the deal he brokered would be the last one, but right now, Hamas holds all the cards.

There's been reporting over the past two days that of the 130 Israelis still in Hamas hands, 30-50 are believed to be dead.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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I see that Hillary Clinton said that Benjamin Netayahu "must go."

And I see that Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez said in Congress that Israel's campaign is not a war but a "slaughter":

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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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Speaking in Tel Aviv, U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blnken said, "Israelis were dehumanized in the most horrific way on October 7, but that cannot be a license to dehumanize others."

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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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At the end of today's short press conference, President Biden was heading out but returned to the podium to answer a question about the Middle East that the more serious foreign policy reporters are describing as the most important thing he said today: he said that Israel's response in Gaza has been "over the top." May not seem like much, but Biden has pretty studiously avoided criticism of Israel's military decisions.

Unfortunately, in what was otherwise a serious and thoughtful discussion of that situation, Biden also said "Mexico" when he meant to say "Egypt." It doesn't matter that he obviously knows the difference, because he was talking about pressuring Egyptian President Sisi to allow Gazan refugees. It doesn't matter that House Speaker Mike Johnson a few days ago mixed up Israel and Iran in a speech. All the political reporters immediately jumped on the gaffe.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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Israel overhyped some early discoveries of Hamas infrastructure, but the Hamas intelligence center accessible via a tunnel about 2,200 feet long and 60 feet below UNRWA headquarters (and apparently stealing power from UNRWA) was viewed by journalists and seems like an important find.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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Stealing, as UNRWA claims, or using with full knowledge and permission, as Israel alleges. Having seen the pictures, I think the latter is more likely.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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N.E. Brigand wrote: Wed Feb 07, 2024 11:31 pm There's been reporting over the past two days that of the 130 Israelis still in Hamas hands, 30-50 are believed to be dead.
Israel rescued two hostages held in Rafah today.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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I know nothing about this person or what her source is, but what she is saying is basically self-evidently true and has been from the beginning.

"Spirits in the shape of hawks and eagles flew ever to and from his halls; and their eyes could see to the depths of the seas, and pierce the hidden caverns beneath the world."
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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Al-Jazeera reports that the United States is proposing a "U.N. resolution calling for 'temporary ceasefire' in Gaza. The proposed resolution by Israel's chief ally also warns it not to launch an offensive in Rafah." This apparently marks the first time the U.S. has backed any kind of "ceasefire" in U.N. language since the conflict started with Hamas' attack in October.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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That would be fairly shocking if true.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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Why? Surely a ceasefire is good news?
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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Absolutely! But blind support of Israel has been fairly myopic in the United States for a long time, so I am surprised to see the Biden administration take this step (if it is true). To be clear, I would be surprised but pleased to see it.
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Re: War between Hamas and Israel

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Ceasefire is only good if both sides adhere to it. Hamas continues daily bombardment of Israeli cities, which goes almost entirely unreported, and refuses to return hostages, some of whom have since been reported dead. They also continue to state the destruction of Israel and its people as their sole goal and denounce any responsibility to their own people, whose government they are supposed to be.

How do you make any agreements with that?
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